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Sujet: DMX Light control with VDJ 6.x ! - Page: 1

Cette partie de ce topic est ancien et peut contenir des informations obselètes ou incorrectes

OK.. I'm starting a new thread related to using VDJ to control DMX lights..

since I just heard (with the new mapper) new possibilities have opened up!

it might take me a few months LOL but i wann 'get er done'!
 
Posté Tue 17 Nov 09 @ 3:55 pm
Just so everyone understands.
this thread is meant to be just about VDJ..
I do realize there are LOTS of great lighting programs out there, that will do the job 100 times better,
but that ISNT what I am trying to accomplish.. I simply want to see if I can get VDJ to do it, and find out ALL THATS REQUIRED TO DO SO
:-)



First..

the "verbs"

dmx : show/hide the lights control window
dmx_color : set the color program
dmx_chase : set the chase program
dmx_black : black all lights
dmx_strobe : activate/deactivate the strobe
dmx_flash : flash all lights
dmx_setvalue : Set an individual dmx value. first parameter is channel, second is value


then some links

http://www.virtualdj.com/forums/115703/Wishes_and_new_features/Full_DMX_Support.html
http://www.virtualdj.com/forums/105355/General_Discussion/DMX_on_VDJ_5_2_1_PC.html
http://www.virtualdj.com/forums/106375/Wishes_and_new_features/Sunlite_SIUDI_6C_DMX_support.html

the last thread probably has the best info so far about DMX.
http://www.virtualdj.com/forums/80000/General_Discussion/DMX__.html
 
ok..

already having my first problem..

the DMX window show 4 "color" buttons (1 to 4)
and 4 "move" buttons..

I now assume thats what the verbs "dmx_color" and "dmx_chase" switch on and off..

the problem is ...
how does a person program those buttons.. especially a chase?
 
GadgetMan wrote :
Then there's the dmx_setvalue verb which recieves parameters of channel & value. However surely this is incomplete:

How does the VDJ DMX engine know which fixture address the setting is for and what it does?


OK..

after reading the other thread I thought I also better write a quick DMX primer so we can all stay on the same page.

Terms

Channels & addresses.. Technically these terms are interchangeable..
USITT DMX 512 was originally invented for theater lighting.. from one "universe" IE: daisy chained cable ,
512 dimmers could be controlled.. since most lighting boards had a fader for every dimmer these were usually called "channels"..
with the advent of programmable 'smart' boards and 'intelligent lighting' that used entire banks of dimmers, calling them "channels" become confusing..
very quickly using the term "address" became the norm..
which makes sense, as "address" is also a programming term and you needed to understand Binary to "patch" your lights to the correct dimmer banks..

soo.. again.. their are 512 'addresses' that are available.. And where you 'put' or "patch" your light in that address'es is your lights "starting address" ..

but wait.. lights have channels too right? a color changer might use 4 channels, and a moving head might have as many as 32 channels!

OK...
this happened because the original portable DMX lighting boards used for intelligent lighting were usually single universe boards with 8 (sometimes 16) faders on it..
to help keep it simple (and probably no one thought that ANYONE would build a single light requiring more then 16 address slots) most manufacturers split the 512 DMX addresses into banks of 16.. (IE: a board that could only run 12 lights would use 192 dmx address'es, where as a board that could run 32 lights would use the full 512 DMX addresses, anything more then that would require a second DMX universe..)
to make things more fun, the addresses are set in binary, so the starting address is actually 0.
the first light would use address 0-15, the second light would use address 16 to 31 and the third light would use address 32 to 47 etc etc..
if the first light used 8 channels then channel 1 equaled addess 0, and channel 8 equaled address 7..
if the second light used 4 channels, then channel one would be at address 32 and the 4th channel was at address 35..

soooo..
long story made short.. the correct modern terms are.
DMX "Address" is a number from 0 to 511
"Channel" is the slot or # related to the programming of that light..
"starting address" is where "channel 1" of that light is "patched" or placed in the 512 DMX address'es..

clear as mud right?

wait till we start talking about scenes VS steps VS chases etc





 
Another clarification I need:
Quote :
dmx_setvalue : Set an individual dmx value. first parameter is channel, second is value


right now I am assuming the programmers (are whoever wrote the descriptions)
used the term <channel> when they should have used the more modern term of <address>
IE: it should read.
"dmx_setvalue : Sets an individual dmx value. first parameter is address (0 to 511), second is value (0 to 255)"
 
The verbs seem logical to me, but it's a bit more complicated than most other software, you need to do the math yourself.

for example:

Use 3 scanning head lights each with 4 channels
All lights are the same, channel 1=pan, channel 2=tilt, channel 3= colour, channel 4=gobo

Using the dip-switches or whatever is on the lights,
fixture 1 would be assigned start address of 1
fixture 2 would be assigned start address of 5
fixture 3 would be assigned start address of 9
agree so far?

Therefore the channels would be as follows:

Fixture 1 Fixture 2 Fixture 3
Channel 1 Channel 2 Channel 3 Channel 4 Channel 1 Channel 2 Channel 3 Channel 4 Channel 1 Channel 2 Channel 3 Channel 4
DMX
Channel 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12


let's say you wanted lights 1 & 2 to be pointing straight forward with a red light coming through a blank gobo, and light 3 set to point straight down with a blue light shining through a square gobo

for this let's assume straight forward would need channels 1&2 of lights 1&2 to be set to 100
straight down would need channel 1 to be set to 100 & channel 2 to be set to 1
a red light would require channel 3 to be set at 18
a blue light would require channel 3 to be set at 5
a blank gobo would require channel 4 to be set at 1
and finally a square gobo would require channel 4 to be set at 70

this would translate into:
light 1, channel 1, dmx channel 1 - 100
light 1, channel 2, dmx channel 2 - 100
light 1, channel 3, dmx channel 3 - 18
light 1, channel 4, dmx channel 4 - 1
light 2, channel 1, dmx channel 5 - 100
light 2, channel 2, dmx channel 6 - 100
light 2, channel 3, dmx channel 7 - 18
light 2, channel 4, dmx channel 8 - 1
light 3, channel 1, dmx channel 9 - 100
light 3, channel 2, dmx channel 10 - 1
light 3, channel 3, dmx channel 11 - 5
light 3, channel 4, dmx channel 12 - 70

Correct so far?

If so I guess to set this would require something like: dmx_setvalue 1 100 & dmx_setvalue 2 100 & dmx_setvalue 3 18 & dmx_setvalue 4 1 & dmx_setvalue 5 100 & dmx_setvalue 6 100 & dmx_setvalue 7 18 & dmx_setvalue 8 1 & dmx_setvalue 9 100 & dmx_setvalue 10 1 & dmx_setvalue 11 5 & dmx_setvalue 12 70

is this right? surely this is too long syntax?

This is purely as I am interpreting this at the moment, I may be totally wrong, if I am I'd be happy to be told so and told how to do it correctly.
I still don't see how to program a chase?
All the above would do, if anything, is put the lights the way I described at the start, I don't see how to save this as a step in a chase?
or even how to save this to a "colour" button in the dmx control panel

Hope this helps make some sense of what I think so far

DJ-C
Craig
 
hippydog wrote :
soooo..
long story made short.. the correct modern terms are.
DMX "Address" is a number from 0 to 511
"Channel" is the slot or # related to the programming of that light..
"starting address" is where "channel 1" of that light is "patched" or placed in the 512 DMX address'es..


Ok,

So I'm with you now. Even though my first light has 5 "channels" it is using addresses 0-4 out of a possible 0-7 and therefore light 2 should be
set to address 8 - if we use the binary model.

I could, if I wanted to set the address of light two to be 5 if I wanted to but that could easily complicate things. Right?

In that case then "channel/address" are interchangeable. Other lighting software just packages this up for you and makes it easier to manage!

So moving on - now I understand this, who do we tell VDJ that channel 0/value 255 on one light and channel 2/255 on another light is strobe so that when I hit the dmx_strobe action they do what they are supposed to...?

In other words, what links the various calls to dmx_setvalue with the relevant dmx function?

Cheers,

Roy
 
GadgetMan wrote :

In that case then "channel/address" are interchangeable. Other lighting software just packages this up for you and makes it easier to manage!

So moving on - now I understand this, who do we tell VDJ that channel 0/value 255 on one light and channel 2/255 on another light is strobe so that when I hit the dmx_strobe action they do what they are supposed to...?

In other words, what links the various calls to dmx_setvalue with the relevant dmx function?

Cheers,

Roy


I always thought DMX started at channel 1 so your first light would be channels 1-5 and your second light would be channel 6 onwards...
channel 1 would be dip switch 1 on
channel 6 would be dip switches 2&4 on

as for how to tell VDJ that pressing the strobe button should set channel 1 to 255 and channel 7 to 255, I have no idea yet :(
 
craigalgar wrote :
I always thought DMX started at channel 1 so your first light would be channels 1-5 and your second light would be channel 6 onwards...
channel 1 would be dip switch 1 on
channel 6 would be dip switches 2&4 on

as for how to tell VDJ that pressing the strobe button should set channel 1 to 255 and channel 7 to 255, I have no idea yet :(


It looks like I've caught up with you guys now being on the same page of the same song sheet...

From Atomix's own admission, the DMX controls are for simple and for shows with less than 10 fixtures.

I only have 5: a pair of ACME Super Leo's, a pair of ACME Magic Gobo's and a KAM Star Cluster 3D.

I also have 2 DMX switches, that simply have an on/off mode. I'm building a simple box for these to control my last 2 non-DMX fixiures so at least I can turn all lights on/off from DMX.

There's only one real scene I want to create and that is to make a single white spot on the dancefloor out of the two Leo's for a first dance, but this maybe beyond VDJ and maybe the point I switch to dedicated software.

In the meantime I'd just like to get the lights going to the beat, be able to turn them on/off and strobe. Maybe even have all the lights turn red, blue, etc.

That's about it.

Cheers,

Roy
 
craigalgar wrote :
I always thought DMX started at channel 1


it does.. and it also starts at binary 0 or 0000000

sometimes the new fixtures and some software hides this from you.. but its important to know it as forgetting it can seriously mess you up.. Especially when setting the address of an older fixture that uses dipswitches

The first address is 0000000
the second one is 0000001
and the third is : : 0000010
and the fourth is 0000011

you can call these "channels" 1 to 4, instead of "address" 0 to 3, but trust me.. when you start trying to 'convert' things back and forth, you are gonna be in trouble when it comes time to troubleshoot why a light isnt working..
 
craigalgar wrote :
is this right? surely this is too long syntax?
I still don't see how to program a chase?


Thats the main part I am having problems with..

in VDJ 5.X when you clicked on the DMX mapper,
it started/opened a "DMX.XML" file..
where you could store your scenes (steps?).. I never went farther then that, so I am not sure if you were also able to set up chases using those same scenes..

basically, What seems to missing in VDJ 6.x is that 'DMX.XML' file and a way to store your scenes there..


hopefully (at some point) one of the Atomix programmers can chime in and maybe explain what they were trying to set up..
 
I'm pretty sure this defaults to only work with the sunlite interface, as I cant seem to find anywhere to select any other dmx interfaces? can anyone confirm? I am trying with an enttec open usb and have ticked serial devices in the mapper screen but still doesnt show. Has anyone had any success with interfaces other than the sunlite.

Yes would be great if someone from Atomix could point us to some documentation or something that shows how to set this up rather than us all guessing and messing about trying to make it go.
 
musicalcheers wrote :
I'm pretty sure this defaults to only work with the sunlite interface, as I cant seem to find anywhere to select any other dmx interfaces? can anyone confirm? I am trying with an enttec open usb and have ticked serial devices in the mapper screen but still doesnt show.


IF (an if cause it hasnt been confirmed that we CAN use other DMX interfaces yet)
IF its possible, I assume that anything besides the SUIDI interface, that a Controller Definition syntax will have to be built
and then a mapper?

Personally I was thinking of getting the SUIDI interface, but first I want to find out if it even works with VDJ 6.x ??
 
No it's not just sunlite. Here's what got my attention - and me interested in this whole subject:

acw_dj wrote :
Well,

Now with VirtualDJ 6.0.3 is easiest than ever... You just need any USB DMX controller and if it has drivers for Windows, install them and that's VirtualDJ need to use it.

Now you have to program it as you do in a MIDI device, the functions available are:

dmx
dmx_color
dmx_chase
dmx_strobe
dmx_black
dmx_flash
dmx_setvalue

Not sure but seems this work too with VirtualDJ and don't cost to much

http://www.vellemanusa.com/us/enu/product/view/?id=522065

Good Luck!


This was posited in the DMX thread in the General Discussion forum.

Cheers,

Roy
 
Hmm - that suggests it should show in the mappers window - mine doesnt but it is a very basic interface so maybe not capable.
 
No, I don't think it will appear. That's the conclusion I have come to and therefore means a very, very manual approach.

My biggest issue now is how do you tell VDJ what a channel/value combination set via dmx_setvalue does so that it knows it relates to a specific task such as blackout, flash and strobe.

Same applies for S2L. Is VDJ just gonna send randon signals to our lights or what?

Without that we're not gonna get very far.

Cheers,

Roy
 
I still think it might be only sunlite too - he doesnt actually say in that post he got it working.
 
musicalcheers wrote :
I still think it might be only sunlite too - he doesnt actually say in that post he got it working.


heck, I would be happy just to here from someone that got the recommended SUIDI interface working with VDJ 6.x

GadgetMan wrote :
No it's not just sunlite. Here's what got my attention - and me interested in this whole subject:

Roy


but on the next page he mentions he hasnt actually done it..

speaking of that

Reading ANY of the DMX threads, I've yet to read anyone posting that THEY have actually done it..
some have said "yes" this is how you do it, but they dont say they have done it themselves..

matter of fact.. my spidey sense it starting to tell me that anyone who HAS posted on the subject is getting the information the same way I am.. from past threads, and past instructions (IE: the wiki etc)..
 
hippydog wrote :
Reading ANY of the DMX threads, I've yet to read anyone posting that THEY have actually done it..
some have said "yes" this is how you do it, but they dont say they have done it themselves..


Hmmm.... Doesn't help that the Atomix team are keeping quiet too!

hippydog wrote :
matter of fact.. my spidey sense it starting to tell me that anyone who HAS posted on the subject is getting the information the same way I am.. from past threads, and past instructions (IE: the wiki etc)..


I get the feeling that when you get it working it opens a portal to another dimension that you get sucked into so you can't tell anyone else how to do it...

Roy
 
GadgetMan wrote :


Hmmm.... Doesn't help that the Atomix team are keeping quiet too!
Roy
 
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