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Sujet: WHERE IS THE LOYALTY NU-MARK ? - Page: 3

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Everybody has presented valid points to substantiate Numark’s decision for going in a different direction with the “primary” software provider for its new controller. Furthermore, I agree with many of these points. However, I still feel that Atomix was somewhat disrespected by Numark. I’ll give the following example to explain my point:

I open a new club and hire dj-in-norway (VDJ/CUE) to be my primary DJ on my busiest nights because he has the skills that are needed to please the crowds on those nights. Therefore, I feel that he is the best DJ for making me the most money during the week. I have other DJs (other programs) to perform on slower nights. I start making BIG MONENY and decide to remodel my club so that I can attract more customers. After remodeling my club so that it will offer more to my customers, I decide to hire A Man and His Music to be my primary DJ because I want someone who can help me “usher in a new era” in my club. I tell dj-in-norway that he can DJ on one of my slower nights. Don’t you think that he’s going to feel disrespected?

Consequently, my point is that VDJ/CUE never got the chance to be the primary software for this new controller. Instead, an outsider was brought in because of the potential to make more money. That’s what it comes down to, who can I make the most money with. VDJ/CUE and Itch will compete for the same market. True turntablist aren’t going to buy this new controller nor will SL customers switch to scratch with "Itch"—which I think is a terrible name….

digimixer wrote :
Some really decent controllers may emerge in the aftermath.

Basically our options are being rapidly increased, which is a good thing for everyone!


I agree.


OO
 

The Serato users are LESS happy than some of you about the Numark and Itch thing ;)



From Serato forums :


"serato just took its name, dragged it in the mud, spit on it and then shit on it."

"I just threw up in my mouth. Unbelievable, Auto beat matching. I think our business just shit on itself."

" ITCH (Bitch it should be called)"

"Financially I can see the reasons they're doing this... but it does leave a bit of a bad taste in my mouth."


"really surprised that Serato would be jumping into this with the likes of Numark and Vestax. When you lie down with dogs...enough said."

"what does worry me though is this new Numark partnering... is there still a Rane influence on the Serato or is the relationship going a little sour?"

" I am disappointed that Serato would stab us real DJs in the back with this crap, microwave-friendly product called ITCH"

"this is the 1st step downhill"





 

To a certain extent I dont really understand Numark on this...
They seem to be hurting, as both sides of the pound find it disloyal.

It might hurt Numark more than it tastes...


I still like the controller though ;) looks cool
 
dj-in-norway wrote :
"I just threw up in my mouth. Unbelievable, Auto beat matching. I think our business just shit on itself."


This ones my has to be my favorite.....where the f**k has this guy been living? Under a stack of vinyl?
 
dj-in-norway wrote :

To a certain extent I dont really understand Numark on this...
They seem to be hurting, as both sides of the pound find it disloyal.


I totally agree with you dj-in-norway

It’s equivalent to a fight promoter (Don “Numark” King) who has contracts with two fighters that eventually fight each other. The promoter doesn’t care that they are fighting each other because he is making money no matter who wins.

TearEmUp wrote :
dj-in-norway wrote :
"I just threw up in my mouth. Unbelievable, Auto beat matching. I think our business just shit on itself."


This ones my has to be my favorite.....where the f**k has this guy been living? Under a stack of vinyl?


Many DJs consider auto beat matching cheating and are disgusted by the idea of a prgoman doing it instead of a DJ.

OO

 
And they feel really bad when they see their "DJ Heroes" (earning tons more than them) using these products at their gigs..
 
man yall can WRITe...freaking nobel prize winning essay contest going on over here..lool..
 
Bagpuss wrote :
And they feel really bad when they see their "DJ Heroes" (earning tons more than them) using these products at their gigs..


Most of the known DJs that I've seen in the U S are using SL. SL doesn’t have many DJ friendly features that VDJ and other programs have. In fact, that is one of the main reasons why many SL users are bashing "Itch" on their Forum. They feel that "Sell-Rato" isn’t staying true to the game. Furthermore, many SL users refer to themselves as “real” DJs. However, they call us "microwave" DJs because we use software that assists DJs with performing certain functions. The fact that they use software is a contradiction to their definition of a “real” DJ.

I remember the days when I lugged crates of 12 inches around along with turntables, mixer, etc…. As an old school DJ, I could consider SL users that rely on software to locate music and load it into a virtual player instead of digging through crates of records (in very dim lighting sometimes), taking it out of the cover, and placing it on a turntable as cheaters.

Anyway, Numark has shown that it is true to the game of making money....

OO
 
Double O wrote :


Anyway, Numark has shown that it is true to the game of making money....




And there's nothing wrong with that.

"It's not whether you're Black or White, The only Colour that matters is green"
 
True.... That's why I hope Atomix gets another hardware partner able to find the ALMIGHTY $$$

OO
 
I think the hardware companies are sticking with whats in their best interest. The battle between atomix and serato is battle of the softwares. I'm glad hardware is open platform.
 
As long as I get my pair of Denon 5500s I am happy..........
 
Double O,

I think the people who draw these conclusions must border on the insane.

When you think about it, MOST of the big name DJ's globally use Pioneer CDJ-1000's and a Pioneer/Allen and Heath mixer, EFX-1000 for effects where installed.

Which gives you:
Separate Waveforms, BPM's (sometimes on the mixer too), Beat-synced FX, and now with the DJM-800: "Harmonic tuning" making it easier to "mix in key".

In terms of the waveform display and BPM readings, VDJ just does these better (although I've long been requesting "waveform mode" selection, consisting of Dual, Single and Off.

Now the function of "sync" is not something you'd depend on in front of large crowds, neither would you depend on "auto gain" or a BPM reading for that matter, in a professional environment these features only serve to make things more difficult, because they are often incorrect or not precise enough to achieve a perfect mix.

Apart from the majority of DJ's using the Pioneer set-up, many are using Ableton, Traktor, VDJ and other similar products that aim to take some of the "work" out of DJ'ing.

As a pro DJ, would you find it easier doing a club night with a Hercules MK2 with VDJ or CDJ-1000's with VDJ? I think I'd go with the latter, the jog wheel settings on the MK2 make it very difficult to get right on beat, where as the CDJ jog wheel can be used to make VERY precise adjustments.

The question is not "who is a real DJ", the question is "How do you define a DJ".

By my interpretation of "Disc jockey", a DJ could be someone slotting money into a jukebox in a pub, the local radio DJ who talks and pushes play, the guy playing music through his ipod at a house party and those DJ's playing/performing to thousands. DJ'ing is not an art, DJ'ing is something that almost anybody is capable of, but it can be an art if one wants to take it to such a level.

I think most of us are here, because we are interested in either: Exceeding the expectations of the customer and/or taking DJ'ing to another level (through artistic manipulation).
 
Re: Beat Matchng features in software.

Many of the top end Decks and Mixers now have beat matching assist features built into them now. Why should software be any different, it's just an option, it doesn't force you to use it and you don't have to use it!

 
@ l_rids

Your post emphasizes my point for starting this thread. Numark is only looking out for its interest in making money. I totally understand; that is what business is all about. From the prospective of a VDJ user, the battle (as you stated) promoter Don “Numark” King and “Sell-out-o” partnership seems unethically. However, many big companies put making money above ethics.

What really bothers me is that a thread was started last year that gave us the chance to inform Numark of the features we wanted in a new controller; Numark took many of our suggestions and made the new controller, but switched software partners. Consequently, I feel that Atomix should partner with some other hardware maker.


@ Bugpuss

An excellently written and articulated post…. Well presented points!


@ digimixer

Good point also.

OO


 
Double O wrote :
TearEmUp wrote :
dj-in-norway wrote :
"I just threw up in my mouth. Unbelievable, Auto beat matching. I think our business just shit on itself."


This ones my has to be my favorite.....where the f**k has this guy been living? Under a stack of vinyl?


Many DJs consider auto beat matching cheating and are disgusted by the idea of a prgoman doing it instead of a DJ.

OO



That's right Double O.

That quote that Norway posted and TEU is reffering to is my favorite also, because it's true.
 
Double O wrote :

What really bothers me is that a thread was started last year that gave us the chance to inform Numark of the features we wanted in a new controller; Numark took many of our suggestions and made the new controller, but switched software partners. Consequently, I feel that Atomix should partner with some other hardware maker.


I think you're not seeing the fact that the NS7 will work with VDJ as well.
Just like the DMC2 and the iCDX both work with both VDJ and Serato. I don't really see the problem.

And what's your issue with manufacturers making money?? Do wish for all brands to sport a non-profit organization, just so you can rest assured that all your moral values are kept intact?
I'm sorry to say this, but unfortunately; money makes the world go'round. Yeah, it sucks but that's reality for ya.
Without making money the manufacturers wouldn't be able to pay engineers to develop new product.
But as usual people tend to b*tch and whine over nothin' instead of embracing the fact that we are getting a great new piece of DJ equipment to work with.
 
And, if it's so that Numark actually took the suggestions from this forum to develop the controller I think you should be happy that you were able to influence the DJ industry with your ideas...
 


Amen..!

And thats the ONLY point that matters to me ... Numark made a new great controller! ;)

Numark was amonst the FIRST to develop gear for software djs, and continue to do so..
If it also works with other dj software, its only natural..

And it benefits all, as it will make it even more interesting for Numark to keep on making great gear for us, if they have a large market for the products ;)
 
k_one makes a very good point. the NS7 will level the playing ground between VDJ and Serato. Ive argued with many DJs who know nothing about the software industry. They keep coming up with stupid points like "VDJ and Serato are not the same thing: Serato is a turntable emulator and VDJ is a DJ software..." and I think, what the hell does that mean? They are the same thing, just VDJ does alot more and Serato is standardized to proprietary software. Now it seems that Rane Itch will be _exactly_ like VDJ which levels it even further. So on the end-user level it will be a true battle of equal odds to see which one is better. My vote is behind VDJ as theyve had more time to develop. There is only one argument for Serato SL in my view, the timecode support is a bit more stable. That will absolutely go out the window with Itch since Rane was always proprietary. It's also the argument why mac was more stable before they entered into the OEM market, there is only one combination which you have to test for. OEM market means the possibilities are endless and the software actually needs to be much more rugged in terms of hardware support to different vendors.

Make no mistake about it, this is an extremely hard thing to do successfully and Atomix has more or less gotten there since v4.3
 
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